The well-known writer Zhou Jieru has several keywords:
One is sojourn. She has lived in Hong Kong for twelve years, twelve consecutive years. Ten years in the United States, plus one year when she resigned as editor-in-chief of "Hong Kong Literature" and returned to Los Angeles to study with her, a total of eleven years. It is equivalent to "living" for half a lifetime.
The second one is born in the 1970s. As one of the earliest representatives of the "post-70s beauty writers", Zhou Jieru dislikes this label and believes that for writers, such labels are "boring, lazy, and very amateurish." The third keyword of
, I think is pause. She was a "famous writer" who wrote many famous articles in her early years, but she stopped outputting at a certain moment. Many "pauses" are to allow the body and mind to take a break, rest their feet, recharge and replenish their batteries before embarking on a new journey. Zhou Jieru believes that some writers should stop after writing for a while. "Aphasia" or "deliberate silence" actually gives themselves a chance to rest and reorganize.
But she also knows that some writers have to keep going uphill. If they want to stop, they will automatically reverse and slide directly to the bottom.
In order to avoid such a situation, she said: I want to leave the earth.
Zhou Jieru
Xiaofan: Teacher Zhou Jieru Hello! I’m glad to have such an exchange. I want to focus this interview on four words, which are also the main title of your new book – “Becoming a Writer”. You are a senior to me, and when I first started writing, some twenty years ago, you were something of a darling of the press and journals. But then suddenly for a while, it felt like I hadn’t seen your new work or written any more for at least several years. You may have expressed it vaguely. My first question today is to follow up. Can you tell us in detail what happened to you and your spirit in those years? You "gave up" writing for a long time - if you can call it that - did you realize something was wrong at that time?
Zhou Jieru: Hello Xiaofan, I am very happy to have reestablished contact with you after breaking off contact for many years. Only the sentence "If you never forget me, there will be an echo" can explain the mystery of this. To me, you are also a writer, and a very unique writer. How others define you or how you define yourself is not important to me. This is how I am, and this is how I classify. Good and Bad, black and white, literary and non-literary, writers and non-writers, no gray, no in-between, it’s that absolute.
I can't remember that I was once a "favorite". Just now I was watching the movie "The Favorite", which was also translated as "Favourite". It was such a drama. I have always been mentally dyslexic, which means that if I am forced to read, I can still read. The reading experience is not good, but I will not be completely unable to read. So watching movies is my way of reading, image reading, and because I have concentration problems, I usually watch movies, play games, and write at the same time, so I can accomplish something. If I only focus on one thing , I may not be able to accomplish anything. My son is like this too, watching movies, playing games, doing homework, and having video calls with his old mother all at the same time. In my opinion, none of them are faults. First of all, I am the same way. Secondly, everyone has their own way. I also respect all writing methods. Some people write standing up, some write naked, and some write a little every day. I respect everyone who stops writing when they write most smoothly. In fact, it's none of my business. Anyone else's business is none of my business. I am absolutely sure again. In my opinion, the movie "The Favorite" is too weak and even a little affectionate. The real competition is very cruel. In my era, if you want to be a "Beloved", you definitely have to work hard. People In an era where everyone strives for talent and hard work, it is impossible to succeed without risking your life.Of course, I still don’t think I succeeded, even though I really tried my best, so I especially care about those who say that I just got lucky with the times. It’s not like everyone is not in the same era, so you are here too Check it out?
I stopped writing and left. It was really simple. I just didn’t want to write anymore overnight. I was bored. It’s really easy to understand when you consider the circumstances of my relationship back then. If you could interview a few of my ex-boyfriends (you would know), I was like this. Overnight, I didn’t love them anymore and I was tired of them. And the worst part is that I don’t know how to explain it. If I can’t explain it clearly, I just disappear. There is no need for explanation when it comes to writing, I just disappear where I am, that’s it. Of course, there is also some zodiac explanation later. The three wind signs are crazy, Gemini, Libra and Aquarius, especially Aquarius. It is normal for them to disappear in an instant without explanation or response. For Aquarius, I really don’t know what to explain, and there is nothing to respond to.
Xiaofan: According to my observation, it seems that many women believe in horoscopes. But I want to talk about gender. In an interview, you mentioned that you hope to be gender-neutral. This is the self-requirement of many writers. But I often feel that this is both unrealistic and a luxury. In other words, it's very difficult. It is difficult for people of the same sex to understand and empathize with each other, let alone those of the opposite sex. What I want to ask is, as a writer who has higher requirements for empathy, what were the moments and events when you had strong empathy with someone of the opposite sex? What is the final outcome?
Zhou Jieru: I think all men or women may become a little neutral when they reach middle age, that is, in a certain sense, they become kind. What does kindness mean? Tolerate everything? Tolerating everything? It is a kind of evolution, or it may be a kind of degeneration, the degradation of body functions, perception also degrades, movements slow down, food absorption slows down, everything slows down. Do you still care about men and women? It’s the same for men and women. Naturally, this reality was realized. I definitely lack some empathy. When watching a movie, I often guess the ending at the beginning. The reversal and reversal are a bit ineffective for me, so I often cannot cry when I should cry. But when it comes to strong empathy, in the movie "Golden Age", Xiao Hong said that meatballs come with soup. That sentence made me burst into tears. This point is not everyone's point. Some people may sigh after her death, and some people may fall into deep thought at the end of the film. For me, that's it, the meatballs come with soup. After watching the movie, I told the writer Wang Qian that I cried like a dog. Wang Qian said can dogs cry? You see, female writers and female writers all have different empathy. But when it came to my husband, from a heterosexual point of view, he said, what's so sad about dying on the hospital bed in an era of chaos and chaos?
Xiaofan: is indeed like this. But I think it is always doubtful that a writer does not write - but it often happens - even those writers who are famous and have published a lot, there are always moments of aphasia or "deliberate silence". Have you noticed any changes in yourself during the days when you are not writing? What is your attitude and reaction to this change?
Zhou Jieru: The days when I am not writing go very slowly. My daughter also said something similar, time passes very slowly as long as I don’t play games. When I came back to write, my life took off again. So time is really relative. To be precise, time does not exist. The time we experience in space and on earth are different. This means that astronauts look younger than ground workers. For a little reason. I mean, if I’m not writing, I look quite young and well-maintained. But when I come back to write, I immediately become haggard, haggard and bloated, but I’m quite rich inside. This also depends on the individual. Some people have to work to be radiant, and they will become depressed immediately without work. Some people just want to show off, and the more they show off, the more they show off. It won't work.So what I want to say is that some writers should stop writing for a while. "Aphasia" or "deliberate silence" actually gives themselves a chance to rest and reorganize, and the body also needs to be recharged. No matter how full the battery is, It will shut down directly when used up. Some writers have to keep going uphill. If they want to stop, they will automatically reverse and slide directly to the bottom.
Xiaofan: After you came back to write, female writing has become a certain trend. Do you think a writer’s gender identity can come before imagination, critical thinking, and empathy?
Zhou Jieru: You must know that I will say no, and no writer will say yes. The fact that women's writing has become a trend is due to the arrival of Lihuo (social progress), and it will remain so for the next twenty years. This is great luck (trend), and as a woman who writes, I can only express my powerlessness (go with the trend).
Xiaofan: In fact, today many people have begun to criticize novels such as "Madame Bovary" and "The English Patient", as well as the three views of the protagonist in the movie "Titanic" - and even the author's three views and value tendencies. . What kind of trend is this and can you summarize it in your own way? I initially thought it was a rise in conservatism in a society during a certain period, but it seems that the truth is not that simple.
Zhou Jieru: I never criticize anyone’s views. All other people’s affairs are none of my business. Ten years ago, I would still care, intervene in the cause and effect of others, and bear the harm caused by those interventions. At that time, there was a woman in the group of wives I was hanging out with who had a very awkward life. She always had to take the initiative to give but was reluctant to do so. I saw that she was in quite a lot of pain, so I asked her out for tea. Tell her that all friends are just phases. Some people only appear in this phase and then disappear. These appearances and disappearances are to help you complete and end some things, so really don’t regard friends as Always regard friendship as everlasting. She looked at me with her big innocent eyes to agree, but immediately went to tell her friends how evil I was, and that my dark power was so great that I would drag every good friend into the abyss. At that stage, I was disowned by every wife in the wife group. One of the kind-hearted ladies came to tell me that the main reason is that the posts I posted on Moments were too depressing. Everyone just wanted to be happy. They couldn’t be happy after seeing your Moments, so no one wanted you to see them. , otherwise we would be even more unhappy. I said you are all sick, shouldn’t you stop looking at my Moments? You closed your own circle of friends and continued to read mine. The more you read, the more unhappy you become. Isn’t this a self-inflicted disease? Then I lost even that kind lady. This was a training and test for me, and I didn’t think I failed, because one day I bumped into that woman downstairs, and she immediately twisted her face and pretended not to see me. and I? Getting closer and closer, I suddenly made a big detour and jumped in front of her face. I don't care how calm she is or how panicked she is, my intention is, I am, I am, I am. Another friend said, why bother? People have forgotten you a long time ago. They live their own good life and don't care about you at all. I said I care about me, and if they forget about me, I will tell them to remember me again. A few days ago, when I was watching "Zhou Chu Eliminates Three Evils", Chen Guilin even walked outside, so why did he go back? Everything is over, and you're not dead either. Wouldn't it be better to let them fend for themselves? On this point, I stand by Chen Guilin. If you want me, I will go back. What does it mean that everything has passed? Death is death. Death cannot be forgotten. I will not let go of any jams or not. I don’t want to talk about the reason anymore. It’s useless to talk about it. I just solve the problem directly without explaining it.
"Becoming a Writer", Baihua Literature and Art Publishing House, February 2024 edition
Xiaofan: The word "principle" does not seem to be absolute. If I didn’t grow every day, it would be difficult to prove it, but I always feel that two or three years is a stage where I can stand alone and re-accept and confirm new “truths”. If you look back in a few years, you will still find that there are big differences in yourself.Time and age are strong catalysts, and our bodies and spirits are mortal and will definitely change. If something happens, we will change even more. For you, you have just started writing, such as Zhou Jieru as a writer when you wrote "Little Demon's Web", and Zhou Jieru who published "Becoming a Writer" today, have you changed? Is it fair to say that you've reached a point where you can sum up your writing career?
Zhou Jieru: For all mortals, people are uniformly divided into four stages: birth, youth, middle age and old age. Old age may be more important. Some people drive high and go low, and have a miserable life in their later years. Some people struggle all their lives and can take a breather in their later years. There are not many people who truly have smooth sailing throughout their lives. I can’t tell anything after two or three years. I always look at it every ten years, from 12 to 22 years old, from 22 to 32 years old, from 32 to 42 years old, from 42 to 52 years old, from 52 to 62 years old, from 60 to 70 years old. Needless to say, many people in ancient times would not survive that time. I am now on the border between middle age and old age. These ten years are not a special decade in my whole life. There will always be ups and downs, ups and downs. This is common sense. If the previous ten years were down, In the end, you have to bounce up a little, and if you finally climb to the top of the mountain, you have to find a way to go down on your own. Some people start writing when they are forty or fifty, and some people have finished writing when they are forty or fifty. For me, it may not be until I am fifty that I can write better and become more professionally advanced. Maybe you will think what is better? Wasn't it good when you were in your twenties? It’s already better than many people, okay? A friend of mine said this, the best luck of a common woman is not as good as the luck of a princess. So you really shouldn’t compare yourself with others, you can only compare yourself with yourself.
To sum up my writing career, I think it is better to be around 74 years old, because I should be able to write by that time, which means that my best works and the works that best reflect my expression have not yet been written. Then I'll write it for another twenty-five years. Then I'll make a summary, which will be more systematic and fair.
Xiaofan: I want to talk about your works. While I was reading, I had a strong sense that the speed in most of your novels is very fast. I mean the speed of the narrator in the novel, not the speed of speech, nor the so-called rhythm of the story. Having read many of your novels, I find that you tell stories in one breath, and you also change narrative roles, but overall they are fast. I can't summarize the specific reasons. Can I ask how you did this? And why? Could this be a label for some of your writing and works?
Zhou Jieru: I need to know why I am a critic, right? I write and comment on myself. How great. I don’t have to please critics or fight with them. Compared to female writers, beauty writers, and beauty writers born in the 1970s, I definitely prefer the label of "one-shot writer", if you must give me a label. Writer Mianmian once said that the speed of her novels is the speed of her heartbeat. Well obviously, my heart was beating too fast. Creatures whose heartbeats are too fast often do not live that long. If you want to live for a long time, you must slow yourself down, slow down your speaking speed, slow down your movement speed, and your heartbeat speed will also slow down. In fact, it doesn't mean much. No matter how slow you are, you can't live more than two seconds, and no matter how long you live, you can't live more than two hundred. What's more, I don't want to live to be two hundred. What I mean is, I just live to the age that I should live to. I don’t speed up on purpose, and I don’t slow down on purpose.
Xiaofan: Despite this, sometimes I can find a slight sense of absurdity, or magical realism, in your novels - this is usually about the era, about what young people are experiencing in the changing times. thing. I also feel like I am watching a story co-written by Kawabata Yasunari and Watanabe Junichi (an analogy, not necessarily correct). There is a kind of story that can make people laugh and cry, but yours is not the same. It can make people laugh and cry. It feels awkward.Is this the ability to tell a story and the fascination that comes from the story itself?
Zhou Jieru: I have read "Snow Country" by Yasunari Kawabata, but I have not read Junichi Tanabe. Mr. Kawabata's tone that he always uses makes me not very comfortable reading it. Later I watched the movie "Izu Dancing Girl". A little dancing girl who was so poor still insisted on asking for a comb. You are short of a comb, right? Can't you miss me silently? I posted a message on WeChat Moments - I also said that there was something wrong with Osamu Dazai, so just pretend. It can be seen that I care more about writers' gossip than their works. For example, Dazai Osamu's first attempt at the Akutagawa Prize failed because Kawabata Yasunari said, "There is something wrong with the author's current life." Dazai Osamu wrote to Tear Kawabata Yasunari said: "Please give me hope and don't do nothing to save me. I will definitely write good works." So although Dazai Osamu gave in, it was better than writing in the letter "I will definitely follow." You have a good time." OK. This is my personal thought. You, Kawabata Yasunari, Watanabe Junichi, wrote so wonderfully together. This is already a kind of absurdity. There is no need to write it. Together, it is absurd. I immediately thought of Zhang Ailing and Ding Ling standing together. That scene was so funny, and Zhang Ailing’s decision to study Ding Ling may not be entirely due to livelihood considerations, but I think Zhang Ailing and Xiao Hong will work together. If a researcher wants to put me together with any female writer in 25 years, I hope it won’t be the same female writer who is currently in the spotlight. Great female writers who have won numerous awards, I just want to be with writer Mian Mian and writer Wang Qian. If you want to scold them, I will join you. If you want to scold me, you can bring them with you. They may not think so, but That's what I thought. This isn’t a female camaraderie, it’s a writer-writer camaraderie, which is probably rare anymore. Later, the younger writers born in the 1990s and 2000s no longer had the need to establish and maintain this kind of friendship. They had not experienced the changes of the times, experienced things, experienced self-criticism and criticism, and the friendship boat. It's easy to turn over at a moment's notice.
Xiaofan: Some people say that fully understanding a person is very risky. If you want to be happy, try to avoid fully understanding others. This seems to be a paradox for writers, how do we write about something we don’t fully understand? Or is it that writers are born to face some kind of pain? Is it pain on the level of thinking, or helplessness on the emotional level?
Zhou Jieru: In , I tend to write about things that I don’t fully understand, and I quite enjoy it. I wrote to my level, I expressed what I was thinking, and my mission ended here, but I also conveyed it. Some critics will dig for me, and readers will dig for me, and often I will find a breadth and depth that I cannot reach myself. For a while, I was particularly interested in gravity. I have always wanted to escape from the earth. I knew that as long as the methods were in place, it would be possible to achieve this escape. But this method, that is, the path, is relatively difficult to find. As long as I have some understanding of physics and astronomy, let alone a full understanding, and a basic understanding, I will know that there is indeed a speed to escape from the earth, which is called the escape speed, 11.2 kilometers/second. If I If I can reach this speed of 11.2 kilometers/second, I can defeat gravity and escape from the earth. But if I reach this speed, I will no longer be the material "me", and time will truly lose its meaning to "me". Finally knowing this, I felt a little disappointed. In the final analysis, I might as well not understand this speed, I can always deal with this problem, which is also a kind of fun. For example, I have always wanted to write a black hole novel. I used to think that black hole plunder is swallowing. The black hole comes, the black hole is huge, and the black hole swallows everything in one go. But if I want to understand, this is not the way of black holes. Black holes do not actively plunder, and matter does not fall directly into the black hole. Instead, it forms a boundary and an edge around the black hole, and then slowly bit by bit. Slide in. Many times, it is truly over when you fully understand it.
Xiaofan: But we all know that writers have many "rights" because of their ability to "create".What is the greatest right you have enjoyed or used as a writer? What was it like at that time?
Zhou Jieru: When my daughter was still in elementary school, I had just come back to write, and she didn’t quite know what I did. The teacher asked what kind of job do your mothers do? Some students answered that my mother is a successful person and has her own business; some students answered that my mother is a professional and has her own business; some students answered that my mother is a housewife and sits at home all day long; my daughter Same answer, my mother is a writer and sits at home all day long. The teacher said, oh, they are all housewives. My daughter said she is a writer, not a housewife. Maybe the word writer is very rare. The teacher didn't react for a moment. He was stunned and said, housewives are also not easy. Housewives are also great. Even though housewives sit at home all day long, their work is also very difficult. It's onerous. When my daughter came home and talked about this class and this teacher, I was a little angry at first. Can a writer be the same as a housewife? Writers are also successful people, okay! He also has his own writing career! Later I figured out that there is nothing wrong with being considered a housewife. I have enjoyed and used the greatest rights of a writer. I can sit at home all day long like a real housewife.
Xiaofan: haha. All right. I have always wanted to ask a question about "literary vision". Some writers have given unclear answers, but I would like to see if Mr. Zhou has a better answer - about whether there is a literary perspective that allows people who are engaged in and close to literature and others to have a certain way of looking at the world. Kind of different.
Zhou Jieru: definitely exists, from a literary perspective. This is the same as the concept of artistic vision. Some people have artistic eyes and some people just don’t. A few days ago, my mother read an article written by my son about one of his classmates. My mother said it was ordinary and had no profound meaning. That's what my mom said. I think my son can accept this comment. But my son is highly regarded for his art photography, and his work is considered to be natural and unfettered by any artificial form. Then I know nothing about art. I don’t know music, and neither does my husband. But my son is a clarinet player in an orchestra. He is self-taught and has never taken a single lesson. I don’t think he has ever practiced. Sometimes he would play in his room, and he was very careful to keep the doors and windows closed, because neighbors still like to complain. I heard that Jacky Cheung was also complained by his neighbors, which made him afraid to sing in his own home. Later, I heard a parent say that her child had hired a famous teacher for one or two thousand dollars per class. I immediately felt that my son was a genius and had saved our family a lot of money. He finally chose to major in art. I asked him, if he is so talented, why not choose music? He said how could someone like me be considered talented? Even a true genius needs to devote 25 hours of practice every day. So many times, the so-called artistic vision and literary vision, in addition to genius, are also based on training and the amount of reading. In my opinion, my mother must have a more literary vision than many people in the industry because she has seen a lot.
Xiaofan: If writing is a way to understand yourself, when did you start to gain experience in this area?
Zhou Jieru: There is a saying that the difference between normal and abnormal lies in whether you realize that the inner voice actually comes from yourself, because schizophrenia will regard the inner voice as belonging to others or gods. Dyslexia is caused by the complete inability to hear one's own voice. I am skeptical about this because I have always felt that I have a bit of dyslexia. Many times the words just jump in front of me, and I am completely I can't understand the meaning of those words put together. But there are voices in my heart, sometimes more than one. When my heart starts to speak (a kind of broadcasting style with smooth words), I quickly write it down, and then use what I write to understand my true heart.So when I realized that writing can help me understand myself better, I started to write more consciously. I published my first work at the age of 15. Of course, I had already started writing before that, but this publication also meant that I really started writing. What I learned about myself.
Xiaofan: Based on this, will you get inspiration from social news? You were shocked or empathized with a certain news event. After watching it, you couldn't forget it for a long time. You moved on, and then you had the urge to protect a certain party, so you started writing?
Zhou Jieru: Social news must have its own reasons for becoming a social news. Some movies become movies, some novels become novels, and every book has its own destiny. For most of us, they are ordinary people, ordinary people’s stories, ordinary people’s stories that happen every day. You have read my novel "A Parting" published in "Shanghai Literature" last year. It is really a story you heard about a woman sitting next to me. I didn't know her, she didn't know me, and she She told half of her life, and I wrote a novel. Not every story or sentence you hear can be turned into a novel. Some are just not enough, and some are just not interesting. I went to get a massage a few days ago. I have been suffering from lumbar, shoulder and neck problems. I have been suffering from a long-term illness. In April last year, I had a major attack. I was completely paralyzed. I took a wheelchair from Daxing Airport to the plane. After returning to Hong Kong, I lay in bed for three months. . If we say it is a privilege for writers, this is one of them. The massage masters were talking right there - some massage masters liked to talk very much and talked from beginning to end, while some massage masters were very silent - the massage master who liked to talk very much started talking about the customer in front of me, whose son was sent abroad. She spent a lot of money to study. She didn’t work after she came back. She just stayed at home. Her temper was very bad. She just heard the customer answer her son’s phone call. She didn’t dare to say that she was having a massage. She only said that she was busy with her own business. . The son's voice burst out from the phone: Are you busy with your business? Her husband didn't dare to stay at home. He would go out in the morning, saying he was going to buy groceries, but actually he was just hanging out. Sometimes he would just sit in a park for a whole day, and then go back to cook in the evening. Well, my son still thinks it’s not delicious and throws the bowl and chopsticks. This is the life of ordinary people, the story of ordinary people, but if it becomes a novel, it is very thin. The master went on to say that if she stayed in her hometown, she would definitely be more comfortable than in Hong Kong. Every one of her relatives in her hometown would be very comfortable. You thought she was going to start talking about half of her life. She started talking about her son, who went to a vocational school with tuition fees of tens of thousands. He graduated last year and found a part-time job. His contract expired a year ago. I have been out of work and have been staying at home for several months. Then she went back and told the story about the customer's son who never went out, but as soon as he turned on the door, he immediately ran to Huizhou. In his early years, his parents bought a house there, and he ran there to sell the house and then pay the money to Huizhou. I can't wait even a moment. Is there a lot of information? There are many details, and the image of a prodigal son is quite lifelike. But they are just stories about ordinary people, not novels. What is a novel? A few days ago, I told an editor friend that I met one of her colleagues at a lunch meeting. I told her that I was late, and her colleague was also late. There was a table that was still a little empty, so we added chairs and sat in hers. My colleague sat on my left and ate for a while. A woman to the left of her colleague started crying, so we stood up and left. Anyway, we also ate the fruit part. My editor friend asked why? Why is that person crying? I said I don't know, and we left emotionally stable. This is a novel. It's hard for me to explain why, but I just know that this is a novel.
Xiaofan: Indeed, novelists can define what a novel is.I suddenly thought, you have accepted countless interviews and answered countless questions from peers or the media. Have you ever had strong regrets about a certain expression of yours or completely denied a certain judgment? If so, what kind of proposition and judgment is it? Is this denial part of an individual's growth?
Zhou Jieru: In 2000, "Little Demon's Web" was published, and I had an interview with Zhang Yiwen of "Beijing Literature". I still used icq, asking and answering questions. She asked me what the Internet has given me? I answered that the Internet gave me love, and I found my first love online. I regretted it, I regretted it deeply, because immediately a female writer born in the 1960s wrote an article and published it in the Youth Daily, saying that I was pretending to be a grandson. If all the beautiful writers born in the 1970s were a basket of rotten eggplants, I would be the worst among them. A rotten eggplant. I don’t quite understand this either, why is it rotten eggplant? Not a rotten apple? Rotten pear? And why pretend to be a grandson? Why aren't you pretending to be me? "Zhou Jieru is just a Pan Dongzi!" Her article ended so fiercely. I immediately asked my mother what Pan Dongzi was? My mother said "Shining Red Star". I haven't watched "Sparkling Red Star". In fact, I am more of a child born in the 1980s, and the movies I watched are also a little bit later. So I went to do some research on Pan Dongzi, and it turned out that what she meant was that I was just a child star and could only shine. Then all of a sudden, and then disappeared without a trace. So I really can't disappear, otherwise I will really take over that Pan Dongzi. I regret it. What I regret is that I was not fierce enough and did not return the eggplant grandson Pan Dongzi to her. All bad words are karma and must have a cause and effect. My current method is to keep coming and going, to maintain a balance, to absorb and spread the good things I receive, and to repay the bad things I receive, otherwise I will not be able to maintain my own balance. If you want to talk about strong regrets, this is it, but I will never regret telling the truth in interviews. I always tell the truth in any interview. What I say is my attitude, the most authentic attitude. On this point, I strongly agree with what Wu Qishi said in the battle between kidneys and female writers three years ago (the war between female writers triggered by kidney donation). I accept everything I said.
Xiaofan: This is another good story. In addition to what was shown in the interview, if Mr. Zhou and a stranger just met, would you look into each other's eyes? Will you pay attention and notice the color in the other person's eyes?
Zhou Jieru: I will definitely look into the other person’s eyes, whether they are strangers or acquaintances, but the eyes have no color. To see the color of a person, look at the top of the head, there will be a halo, and the color of the halo will be It changes. If you are in a low mood, it will be darker, and if you are happy, it will definitely be brighter. These are not what I saw, they were said by my daughter, because I can't see those colors, and she can't see them either. She has a classmate who can see it, and she is a classmate who is not very familiar with her. One day, he suddenly said to her changed the color of her head. My daughter was shocked and later asked her classmates how they saw it? The classmate completely denied what he said. It's really weird. I have taught my daughter a method to protect herself, which was also taught to me by others. It is basically to condense all your energy and summon a golden protective shield for yourself. Under the protective shield, you will naturally be invulnerable to all harm. My daughter said why is it golden? And didn’t he summon a protector? That's how "Harry Potter" expresses it. Everyone calls out their mythical beast when they are in the most critical moment. What I mean is, if it's not so critical, just put a cover over it, defense is the main thing. As for gold, I don’t know why it is gold instead of silver or other colors. This is what others taught me.
Zhou Jieru's comeback work "Rose on the Island", Jiangsu Phoenix Literature and Art Publishing House, March 2016 edition
Xiaofan: It seems that you will draw energy from your own daughter. As for the generational generation of literature, most of us writers find it boring, lazy, and even amateurish. But because of the need for efficiency and social communication, there are always people willing to do this, including many commentators.What do you think of this issue? In addition, what did you think of those born in the 1980s and 1970s ten years ago? What now? Are there any authors you like among them?
Zhou Jieru: is boring, lazy and amateurish. The people who did it, including many commentators, never corrected or reflected on themselves, and the writers had no choice but to compromise and reconcile. My views on generations have never changed. Whether it is ten years ago or ten years later, the objection I want to raise is that it is definitely unscientific to distinguish one generation from another in ten years. I think it is necessary to distinguish one generation from another in six years. It is up to me. From personal experience, people born in 1970 can still have brothers and sisters, but not six years later. Everyone’s growing environment and circumstances are completely different. How can they be considered one generation? People born in 1970 only need to go to elementary school for five years, but when it comes to me, I have to go to sixth grade. What does this extra year of elementary school mean? I'm not asking for any compensation, I just want to explain the matter clearly. There is also the concept of "pan". Those born in 1978 and 1979 are called those born after the 1980s, and those born in 1988 and 1989 are called those born after the 1990s. So those born in 1999 are called those born after the 1990s? The year God wants you to be born in must have its own reasons, so why be stubborn? Although my destiny is up to me, the day of your birth is really not up to you. Otherwise, it is a natural disrespect for the way of heaven. We must put an end to it. As for authors, my views have not changed. Since my classification method has always been to divide authors into authors and non-authors, writers into writers and non-writers, and literature into literature and non-literature, so at that time I considered him an author. The author will always be the author, and the author who I did not think was the author at that time is still not the author.
Xiaofan: So what kind of experience does being a writer or female writer bring to your real life and inner life that is different from those in other industries? Have you ever wondered whether a writer could achieve basic success if he did other work? For example, if you had become a designer, a businessman, or even a politician in your early years, among these options, would you have achieved a higher level of achievement than in writing?
Zhou Jieru: The summer jobs I have worked include travel agencies, radio stations, paging stations, computer companies, magazines... I have worked as an announcer and civil servant. I will be a very ordinary announcer or civil servant. From the beginning, I You know, I also knew from the beginning that I was most suitable for writing. It was just an intuition, and my intuition was often right. A few days ago I met my old leader who was working in the agency, and I asked him, do you think it would be better if I stayed back then than now? He said that you must not have achieved the writing success you have today. I knew he would say that!
Xiaofan: Identity is definitely a kind of politics and one of the themes pursued in literature. Many foreign writers and domestic critics like to discuss this, but you seem to be reluctant to discuss it. Although you have a history of living in many places, have you never had any doubts about your identity and self-definition? If you don't have this suspicion, doesn't it mean you're not sensitive enough, at least in this regard?
Zhou Jieru: I definitely have never doubted . It’s not that I’m slow or not sensitive enough. I’m just not interested. It’s like walking on the street. If I see a group of people watching something, I will definitely walk around. How far away is it? No matter how far it is, of course there are people who want to come over immediately to watch the fun, right? I want to buy something. If I have to queue up, I won’t buy it and just turn around and leave. Anyway, I don’t queue up, so some people must have queued up when they saw there was a queue. Only when they were about to queue did they realize that there were fresh meat mooncakes in front of them. It’s still Wuren mooncake, people are so different. I had to have a special self-positioning. I positioned myself as an "alien prisoner who was forced to come to Earth." Once my sentence was over, I went back and forth from where I came. This is how I positioned myself.
Xiaofan: I understand . Some writers say that directors do not need to read movies, but they must read novels; novelists do not need to read novels, but they must read poetry. What kind of content do you think is necessary and must-read for you to write?
Zhou Jieru: In fact, as I said at the beginning, I have a little difficulty in reading. My must-read is movies. I have to watch some movies every day, and clips are OK. Sometimes short plays and long plays are not good.When I was young, I had to control my attention disorder a little bit, but now I let it go without restraint at all. As for long-form dramas, I recently watched "One Piece", "The Last Airbender" and "The Brothers", all while washing dishes. "The Brothers" is so good, it makes me miss Los Angeles. My son even bought the Jims Bakery that appeared in the show, saying it has the best egg tarts in Los Angeles. But if I go to Los Angeles to see him, he will still Ask me to bring a box of bear biscuits from Tsim Sha Tsui Mirador. I used to choose movies to watch, but now I don’t choose. I watch whatever is available, and everything is arranged in the best possible way, so sometimes I will be recommended an inspirational movie, "Ned", which makes me feel like I am six years old. Even when I was ten years old, I could still work hard; sometimes I would be shown an awakening movie, "Don't Worry, Dear", which would make me shout out, "This world is not my independent choice." In fact, it’s quite scary to think about it. For example, I just noticed that the writer Zhenli was talking about practical writing for Japanese housewives, and the system immediately recommended "Invasion Dinner" to me. Of course, I also laughed like watching "Paper Moon Wife" No, but I am very clear in my heart. Practical writing is practical writing, and practical writing is not literature. The best language movie I have seen recently is "Open Heart", excellent, excellent. When it comes to personal preference, it's like some people just love "Reminiscences of Lost Time". I have a strong preference for "Death", every season, every episode. There is an episode of "The Pulse of the Machine" about the communication between a planet and a human being. "She jumped. For a moment, she was flying." It particularly touched me. This leap is my point. Why is it my point and not anyone else's point? This has to do with my special concern for Uranus. All stars rotate and move. This is science. However, there is one planet that does not move in its own orbit. It rolls and moves. It is Uranus. It is a planet that absolutely does not respect authority and does not act. The star in any disguise is the part of us that refuses to be crushed by the rules, and it is also our greatest courage. Use your courage to make conscious, consistent life choices. This is the "Uranus Leap." As long as I can write one episode of "Love Dead" in my life, I'll be satisfied.
Xiaofan: Some people say that "a serious death is when an old man must die in the hall at home." Have you ever thought about death? You have written about death ("A Farewell" and "I Thought I Would Never Laugh Again"), but I only saw your fear and avoidance of death, and your joy that you didn't have to die in the end. Forgive me for saying this - is death a subject and tool that you like or resist?
Zhou Jieru: My daughter's first Chinese work was published in "Shanghai Literature", and the title was "Death is not always a bad thing". I still don't like this title, because, indeed, I don't like death, but I Not too resistant. When I was young, I was a little afraid of flying, because I still had parents to take care of, so I couldn't have an accident. After I got married and had a child, I was also afraid of flying, because I was afraid that if I had an accident, no one would take care of the child. I am afraid of coming and going, and none of them are for my own sake. In other words, if I do not consider the old or the young, I am not afraid of death. But isn’t it true that there are seniors and juniors at the top? I have to think about it when I curse others. Once I was taking the MTR and saw a woman bringing a bird onto the train. She let the bird out to play with for a few times. I definitely wanted to scold her, but because my daughter was next to me, I was a little hesitant. When I arrived at Tai Wai Station for the bus captain's shift change, during the break, I pointed out the woman and the bird to the bus captain, and I said, there is a bird there. The driver said, "Oh, I'm leaving after get off work." That woman just stared at me, but I could only endure it because my daughter was beside me. There is a saying that many people agree that Hong Kong girls can hit people. I didn’t want to fight with a Hong Kong girl in front of my daughter. . When we arrived at Diamond Head, the woman and the bird got out of the car. Sure enough, she gave me a middle finger... The woman quickly ran away, taking her bird with her.When the car door closed, I was very excited and wanted to go back and have a fight with her. However, because I had family around me, I had no choice but to go to East Tsim Sha Tsui Station and tell their staff that there was a bird on the car just now. MTR staff said there was nothing we could do about this situation. I asked, can birds take the MTR? The staff said that birds are not allowed to ride on our subway, but there was nothing we could do. At that moment I really wished I had taken a plane instead of the MTR, then the bird must have been a problem. During this period, my daughter kept looking at me, and I was also disappointed in myself. Am I not supposed to be a just and enthusiastic citizen? If everyone condones evil, won't evil become even more evil? I told Professor Zheng about this later, and he said you could write a novel. I have never written a novel, but if I had to do it again, I would definitely rush up and fight with the woman without saying a word, so that neither she nor her bird could get out of Diamond Head. For what I think is justice, I can really risk life and death.
Xiaofan: In daily life, you often mention your children, but rarely mention your husband. Do you have a male role in some psychological way? There are some outdated male thinking. For example, many bad men will believe that the value of their spouse or partner is less than that of their children - and modern civilization has denied this. How does the meaning, or emotional value, of a partner and children come to you?
Zhou Jieru: I also often mention my husband, especially in the circle of friends, and often post his poems, so he has many fans in his own way, and some of them lost his fans from me. his. In my last conversation, I mentioned him a lot with Professor Wei Shiyu from City University (City University of Hong Kong). Professor Wei said that if someone scolds your husband, you will defend it. I said yes, it’s not that I’m not allowed to scold him, it’s that I have to scold him. I will scold my husband myself, and I definitely won’t agree if others want to point fingers. As mentioned earlier, I am a little constrained because I have a family to support, and I don’t feel comfortable swearing at others. But just because I have a husband, I dare to resign. Yes, my husband is the confidence and capital for me to resign, so I Although I have a lot of complaints against him, but also considering that I can resign but he cannot resign, and if I don’t make money, he has to make money, and his dedication and sacrifice, I put a lot of my complaints into novels instead of real life.
Xiaofan: Many writers will develop resumes for their creations. I also got a copy of your creative resume, which can be said to be very rich information. When I saw this information, my first thought was shock. This is accounting, writing a diary. When I was a child, I also had this collecting habit. Diary is a kind of collection. Until one day, I heard that keeping accounts and diaries is a betrayal of life itself. I was convinced at the time. From that day on I never kept a diary. How would you approach your creative resume?
Zhou Jieru: Then you haven’t seen my diary. That is real writing. For someone who can write tens of thousands of words in Moments, of course the diary should be written as a novel. And you also know that I don’t write long novels. I've been thinking that if I hadn't burned all my diaries before going abroad, I would have four novels now. And for a long time, I still remembered my dreams by putting pen and paper next to my pillow and writing them down as soon as I woke up, because those dreams would disappear as long as they lasted more than thirty seconds. But my most detailed creative resume is from 2013 (the first novel after returning to writing, "Go to Hong Kong", "Shanghai Literature" Issue 9, 2013), because all the previous information has been lost, and some works There were some meetings that I couldn’t even remember that I had written about or attended until someone brought out the publications and photos. It felt like I had really been hit by a car. I didn’t have complete amnesia. I remembered things from my childhood. What I remember now is that I have forgotten the period from the age of 12 to 24, which is selective amnesia. It may also be that during those 12 years, I suffered some things that I chose to forget.I may also have a collecting habit, but I am relatively simple. I like to collect publications and published publications. It can be said that I just want to publish every publication in China. I published almost all the publications before I stopped writing for the first time. , but there are still a few, so after I returned to writing, I was busy publishing all the publications that had not been published (it seemed that only "PLA Literature" and "Woodpecker" were left). If you want to say this is a disease, but maybe I just want to prove that I can be salty or sweet? I can handle every style.
Xiaofan: Then I very much look forward to seeing the publication of "Zhou Jieru's Diary" one day. I am like this. For many writers, even famous ones, I cannot form trust or gain favor. It wasn't until one day that I read a work that shocked my heart that I truly appreciated the writer who wrote it. What is your path to developing trust in other writers?
Zhou Jieru: I don’t think I can trust all humans, especially writers. I am committed to writing about people, people themselves, so I didn’t believe it from the beginning. I don't even believe it myself. A while ago, I was doing some physical and mental exploration because I was a little lost and couldn’t see my own spirit, my own heart, or even my own body. In fact, the spirit is the subconscious mind. It is indeed something that I don’t even know. What about my own mind? , others don’t know much about it, but I should know it, but I can’t see clearly in my own heart. I have deep doubts and denials about myself. Everyone in the real world I live in next can see it. I You won't be able to see it either. So I want to spread out these problems and let myself see, accept, analyze, and solve them. But that is just an exploration, and disbelief is still disbelief. Each of us has our own lesson, maybe mine is "believe", just like "The Polar Express", some people are "brave", some people are "hope", who knows? I haven't passed this test yet, but "it doesn't matter where the train goes, the key is whether you are willing to get on the train or not." I think I'm already in the car.
Xiaofan: There is a writer who believes that his works are popular and receive courtesy from readers and critics. "It is not a victory of creativity, but a victory of understanding." What do you understand by this sentence?
Zhou Jieru: First of all, I don’t understand this sentence. What is the victory of creativity? What is the victory of understanding? Many writers just make things up a bit. Can he explain it himself? victory? From what I understand, all writing is winning. I made this very clear in my article "Small Dialogue: Faith". "If I say that the process itself is an end point, I don't know if I have expressed what I mean. In other words, it is not a question of success or failure. For a real writer, the act of writing itself is a completion." Although My article was not about writing but about faith. Only when the belief can persist even when it is absolutely impossible to realize it, can we say that we have faith.
Xiaofan: Finally, I want to ask, the four words "become a writer" can be considered incomplete, as if there is another sentence or paragraph after it. Teacher Zhou, can you tell us the whole story behind it?
Zhou Jieru: I have an activity for this new book, and the name is - "Becoming a Writer": Become the person you want to be.
(Xiaofan, writer, former media person, freelancer.)
